CG [FP]: "Even though you’d be working for Image."

CA: Yeah, well, exactly. Most of the Image books don’t sell enough to pay for the creators. But even back then The Walking Dead did.



CG: If I remember correctly, The Walking Dead was one of the books that started under the Valentino rule over Image, which was a bit more experimental. And then the lead went over to Erik Larsen. So, did you notice a change when Larsen took over as Editor in Chief?

CA: Not really. I think any idiot would know that if a book makes money, you keep it going. And obviously The Walking Dead is one of the top titles. Other than it: There’s Spawn and that’s about it. It’s one of their biggest money makers. To use a British phrase: If it ain’t broke, why fix it?

No, I haven’t noticed any change. There might be more changes in the general direction Image is going. Well, I say that, but I haven’t even noticed a change there. Because, I always assumed once Erik took over that everything would go back to the old superheroes again. And it’s not actually.
You know, Jim was trying to push the more experimental stuff and the reason they got Erik on board was so they could do more commercial stuff. But, I know for a fact that they’re gonna publish a couple of friends of mine who did an artbook together. They were gonna self publish it, but then Image said to them: “We’re gonna publish it.” And I was like: That’s not a particularly commercial move. They’ll do okay, but artbooks aren’t exactly great money makers.

I think, even though Erik Larsen is kind of in charge, the day to day running is down to Eric Stephenson, the editorial director. I know him quite well and he’s certainly not Mr. Superhero. He’s more into the experimental stuff. You know, they published that comic book based on the songs by Belle & Sebastian. And that’s Eric. That’s completely Eric. Because he’s a big Belle & Sebastian fan.
He actually asked me if I was interested. And I was. I was interested, I just didn’t have the time. It sounded really interesting. My wife is actually more into Belle & Sebastian. I quite like them, but... yeah... that’s it. If they ever do a Nick Cave one, I’ll do one of those.
I think it’s because of Eric. He’s more proactive for the experimental stuff. I don’t think Image’s changed that much. It’s just name juggling sometimes...



CG: Shuffling the deck chairs. Not on the Titanic, but...

CA: Yeah, exactly. It’s like a governmental, cabinet reshuffle. Things really don’t change.



CG [FP]: How difficult is it not to create characters, but to work with existing characters, having to stick with them?

CA: What, d’you mean, the likenesses and everything?



CG [FP]: I think if you start a comic book as a creator, you’ve got the script, but you’ve got your own images in your head, how the characters look. But here, with The Walking Dead, everything was given. Is this also a bit disappointing?

CA: It was the first ten or so issues that I did it. Let’s say, the first year. I never felt like it was truly mine, because Tony had started it and obviously most of the characters were his. And the images of his characters were his. And I was just on board, feeling like it was work for hire.
You know, there were a couple times were I almost left. Not because I didn’t enjoy working on the book, but because I didn’t have that much attachment to it.



CG [FP]: So, what kept you?

CA: Well, I enjoyed the stories. And frankly, no serious offer came along to pull me away either. I mean, I almost did leave right at the beginning, after I did an issue or so. Then I got offered Warlock from Marvel and I remember, I wrote an e-mail a couple of days after I accepted that, saying: “Well, I’ll do the first six issues for you and then I’ll go on and do Warlock.” Do the paid stuff, or rather the better paid stuff, y’know.
It was only because Robert and Eric Stephenson both wrote me e-mails, saying: “Please, please, don’t leave.” Especially, I remember, Eric’s e-mail was really quite strong in defense of The Walking Dead and against Marvel.
He was saying that this book is gonna be big and it’s gonna take off. You got all the creativity, you’re going to end off making more money on this. Why d’you want to work for Marvel? This title is probably going to be buried and it won’t last and blablabla.

And... he was right. Yeah, he was right. Warlock lasted four issues, and that was it. It was a blessing in disguise, because I tried doing them at the same time, but after four issues I was falling behind. And one of them would have to go anyway, and fortunately Warlock went. Which was the best decision made for me in my life, I think. Because, I almost made the wrong decision. Imagine how I’d be feeling now if I had left The Walking Dead and then Warlock would have been cancelled. I’m glad I stuck on.

By now I’ve done so many more issues of The Walking Dead. It’s, like, 24 issues I’ve done now. And I think I’ve put my stamp on it more than Tony. It feels like a creator owned book now for myself, because Robert gave me this incredibly generous 30% share of the creator owned rights to everything.



CG [FP]: That’s not quite usual?

CA: No. He could have taken it all for himself, and I wouldn’t have objected. Because it’s his right as a creator. If he got me on board and would have offered me a page rate, I would not have objected to that. It’s in the same way that Larry always said, if Astronauts in Trouble ever gets made into a movie, or a TV series or whatever, I’ll always get something from it. Even though it was work for hire. But I’m so intrinsically involved with it now that I’m almost perceived as a creator. Even though it says that it was created by one person.



CG: Do you think you might leave The Walking Dead if Marvel or DC ever came along and said: “Hey, we’ve got this other book for you.”

CA: What could they offer me that would be as attractive as The Walking Dead? Nothing. Because, if Marvel offered me an exclusive contract, ten years with a fixed page rate, I would end up working for ten years on somebody elses characters.

As much as I get a buzz from working on Spider-Man... and I haven’t done that for a long time. Yet, I’ve done a Spider-Man issue, I’ve done Batman, I’ve done Superman, I’ve done most of the iconic characters at a certain point.



CG [FP]: Y’know, two days ago in our interview with Humberto Ramos, he was saying: “Once you’ve done Spider-Man, where do you go from there?”

CA: Yeah, he went to the creator-owned stuff and that’s the only way to go. Because you can’t go higher. Once you’ve done one of their big characters for a long term, that’s it. Surely that’s the pinnacle of work for hire.
Personally, I prefer to work for DC. Not because I prefer their characters, but I do believe they got more variety. Marvel are very much... they are just superheroes. Everything has to be superhero. They do have Marvel ICON, but there are very few books.



CG: Basically it’s like, if you do our superheroes, you can do your own creator owned stuff at ICON.

CA: Basically, yeah. It’s an enticement for the bigger names to sign exclusive contracts. If you work for us, you can do your creator owned stuff.

I had offers from Marvel. Not exclusives, but I had various books they offered to me. The Punisher was offered to me. I know Garth [Ennis] and I like Garth, and of late he really wanted to work with me. I turned down Garth twice in the last couple of years. And it’s no disrespect to Garth. I’d love to work with Garth, but I never have done. I turned down The Punisher and I turned down the last Authority: Kev. But, as we say: Third time lucky.

Creatively, with The Walking Dead, we got no interference. We can do what we want. For some artists that’s a bad thing. Sometimes it’s nice to have someone say: "No, come on, you’re getting away with yourselves". So, I’m not saying that’s not a good thing, but at the moment it feels good to have no interference.

And to be honest: Financially, if you add all the royalties, I’m making more money than Marvel can possibly offer me as a page rate. That’s how they offered me a job, they offered me just a page rate. And I said: I have an official page rate. Double it, guys. And they wouldn’t double it...



CG [FP]: With The Walking Dead, your earnings are tied to the sales?

CA: It’s not a fixed page rate. No. I get an advance from Image, which was just another little enticement to get me initially. Because I was so: Oh, I don’t know about the whole page rate thing.
So, Image said: We’ll pay you a fixed sum. Every time you turn in a comic, we’ll send you a cheque. It’s not much, but it’s what they know the comic initially guaranteed. So, they could afford to offer that. And every month, or roughly every month, I get another cheque, which is for the proper sales figures.

And then there is what they call the accrual cheque, which is the six-monthly cheque. Which is the really big one. And these are just stratospheric, since The Walking Dead is always the number two or number three best selling graphic novel every month.

If you had a graphic novel on Spider-Man and it sold like The Walking Dead, you’d still just make a miniscule ammount of money, because you only earn three or four percent of the book when you are doing Spider-Man. Marvel takes the lion share. And on this, after Image have taken their cut--which is not much--Rob and I just take the remaining seventy or sixty percent of the earnings. That’s the difference.



CG: I notice, you’re really happy with the creator ownership over at AiT/PlanetLar and Image.

CA: Yeah, I’m very happy. The problem is: It’s nice to be in the ivory tower, looking down on everybody going: Creator owned is the way it should be. I remember a couple of years ago, I met Mike Oeming [of Powers fame] and he just said: “Charlie, creator owned is the way to go. It’s the only way to go.”
And I was like: It’s all very well for you to say that, Mike. You’re doing right. You regularly sell 30,000 a month. You are making good money. You can easily say that. You sold the option for a lot of money. Blablabla.You can sit back, relax and do your comic. And you can pick and choose whatever else you want to do.

But when you are an artist, especially if you’ve got responsibilites--and as I said, I’ve got a wife and two children--you can’t afford to do that. If you’re a writer, you can. You can do two or three books a month. It’s easier for a writer to do something creator owned. It’s just part of your working day. But there’s not many artists who can do more than one book a month. So you’re basically commited. And if it is creator owned, you don’t get paid upfront. How do you survive?

But now I’m making the money. I can get into my ivory tower next to Mike. And the two of us can now go: Aah, creator owned, that’s the way to be. I can also recognize its pitfalls as well as its perks.
However, if it works it’s just the best thing. My career is at the best it’s ever been, because of it. I can do The Walking Dead, which is fantastic to do, and then I can do stuff like Rock Bottom. Well, it’s for Larry, so it is creator owned. And the script is so good. It’s by Joe Casey. The script is so good: I just had to do it.

It took me two years to do it, because I was actually doing it between The Walking Dead. But it’s a great feeling to be able to just pick and choose. And it’s so nice to be able to think: Well, I make so much off The Walking Dead, I can afford to do something for nothing. Which is brilliant. I don’t have to think: It has to be paid, because I need to survive.

some pages from Rock Bottom:

I’m actually doing something for 2000AD now. Which is paid. But 2000AD doesn’t pay titanic pay compared to those, obviously. But that’s also something about the love of it. It’s something by Pat Mills. It’s one of his best stories.



CG [FP]: So we were wondering about the British comic scene...

CA: The lack of it, yes.



CG [FP]: Yeah, the lack of it. That’s right. Why are so many British authors [Moore, Ennis, Ellis, Morrison, Millar,...] writing for American books?

CA: That’s because there is no industry in Britain.



CG [FP]: Why? There are so many talented...

CA: Well, there’s no industry, there’s only 2000AD.



CG [FP]: Is it because of the lack of readers?

CA: I don’t think it’s that. It’s the perception --especially in Britain--that comics really are for kids. I mean, not even kids but...



CG [FP]: New born? [grins]

CA: Virtually, yeah. The majority of comics in Britain are comics that are just pre-school comics: Thomas, the Tank Engine and things like that. Even though there’s a Thunderbirds comics. But even that is designed for little children.



CG [FP]: But this is strange, because so many British comic creators are really famous in the US.

CA: Well, we all work for America or Europe or the places that pay the money. You can still work for 2000 AD. You still get the odd big name creator doing something--like myself--but... uhm...
Back in Britain the BBC has just started to produce a Dr. Who comic. So there’s a Dr. Who comic now to run with 2000AD. And there’s the Judge Dredd Megazine. But they’re not huge. That’s it.



CG: Do you feel like 2000AD is like a farm team for American companies? Because Andy Diggle [The Losers] tried to strengthen it again...

CA: When he was the editor?



CG: Yeah, when he was the editor, when Revolution took over.

CA: Well, the funny thing about Andy is, he basically is the shortest running editor on 2000AD. No disrespect to Andy, I can actually quite respect him for it: He’s obviously a really good business man. He used his editorship at 2000AD to make the contact to the States, so he could kick start his freelance career. And he’s doing alright for himself now.



CG: Which would be another case in point for 2000AD as a farm team.

CA: Yeah, he farmed himself. I mean, you look at any creator that has a degree of work for 2000AD. I mean, the last two major talents to go over to the States, were Jock and Frazer Irving. And they are both are doing pretty much just American work now.

CG [FP]: But it’s so sad that there are so many talented artists leaving...

CA: Yeah. It is sad, but I suppose in the end, there’s more opportunies working in the States as well.



CG [FP]: Another question, just coming back to The Walking Dead. Since your art is kind of different from Tony’s, did you get any reactions from fans?

CA: Oh, yeah. But it was to be expected. Because the fans, with these sort of things, tend to be quite conservative.
I think if I was a fan, it would be the most frustrating time to be in American comic books as a fan, because no creator does stay on. It’s very rare to get a creative team staying on a book for more than, well, six to twelve issues?
Think of much of the runs back in the sixties and seventies, and even the eighties, that American creators did on certain books. And now when you get a twelve issue run on something, you think: That’s a long one. Shit, no. But, um, what’s the question again? [laughs]



CG [FP]: The reaction of the fans...

CA: Oh! Yeah, yeah, yeah. I just knew that Tony... because he started it as well...



CG [FP]: His drawings and his zombies were very detailed. And he said, that he studied anatomy...
CG: Police photographs, different states of decay...

CA: Oh, okay. Well, I suppose my art is a bit more expressionistic.There is less detail, there’s more light and shades and perhaps more subtlety. I’m not dissing Tony Moore when I’m saying that. But, you know, I tend to hide more stuff in the darkness than Tony does.
There was a reaction. It was like: "Uh, what’s this?" Tony was great. But I do think it was also because the fans were just used to his artwork.

"Honestly, Charlie, it's this big..."

If you take over an established character like Batman, you don’t get that reaction, because everyone is so used to him being drawn by so many different artists. There is no one artist that has established Batman or Superman or Judge Dredd or whatever. There’s no one that established that look. But because Tony started it, there was a look established. And I come in and I’m not going to copy Tony Moore. I’m going to be me. But, like I said before, I hope that after 24 issues, that it’s my look now.



CG [FP]: How many issues are you usually in advance to...

CA: Not many, just a couple. Twenty-eight just came out and I’ll finish 30 tomorrow.



CG [FP]: Ah, that’s why you cannot stay very long here in Erlangen.
CG: How far are you in the entire zombie thing? Have you been a zombie fan before this came along, like, have you seen the Romero movies?

CA: Oh, I like the Romero movies. And Shaun of the Dead. I think it’s hilarious. I’ve seen 28 Days Later. Danny Boyle was the first guy to claim: That’s not a zombie movie. And you go: Oh yes, it is, Danny. It is a zombie movie.
I used to watch Italian stuff back in the eighties. But I wouldn’t confess to be a massive zombie fan. I didn’t do the book because of the zombies.



CG: Have you been influenced by a certain style of drawing or something? The farmhouse [from the second paperback] standing all alone in the wilderness always reminded me a bit of that secluded house from the original Night of the Living Dead. So, have you been influenced by the styles from the movies?

CA: Not really, because I haven’t seen NotLD for a long time. I’d like to have another look at it, actually, primarily because it’s a black-and-white movie.



CG: It has lost its copyright and is in the public domain now. You can legally download it [you can download it for free here].

CA: Oh really? That’s good to know! But anyway, black and white movies are very interesting because I work in black and white. That’s why black and white movies are a lot more interesting to look at sometimes, because the lighting is always so much more contrastive. I mean, I’m a horror fan. A casual fan, not a really big horror fan. My favourite horror movies tend to be the more subtle things. I’m a big fan of films like The Haunting and Halloween. Things like that. Lots of really great stuff like The Others.
I just like that. I love horror movies that don’t show the monster. It’s more scary if you don’t see things, if your imagination takes over.
So, that’s where I come from and I think it kind of shows in how I do it. Because unless Robert asked me something very specific, I just move the camera away from the terror, because I think it’s more effective that way.



CG: So you are not like most zombie fans who say... and we even had that in Shaun of the Dead... we have to see the guts spilling out.

CA: I mean, by its very nature zombie movies have to be gory. Because they are dealing with walking corpses.



CG [FP]: Just two last very short questions.

CA: I’ll try and keep the answers concise.



CG [FP]: What did you learn in the comic industry since you started? What did you expect and how did things turn out to be?

CA: That’s an interesting question. I should be concise now, but I’d have to sit back and think about this one.
It wasn’t different to how I expected it to be. It’s a dream for certain. It’s something I always wanted to do since I was aware of comics, which was when I was five or six. So from that respect I’m doing exactly what I want to do.
But when I started, it didn’t take long for the wow factor, for the magic to wear off. And it became...



CG [FP]: ...a job?

CA: Yeah, well. It’s not a job and yet it is a job. I love every day of work. And sometimes I prefer the working days to the non working days, because you can’t beat a day of creating. What a fantastic feeling that is. It’s just always creating and it’s brilliant.
There are down sides, such things as dead lines and such... but they are such a minor downside. I like to think that if I moaning about something... like when I did Green Arrow, Green Lantern, I was seriously cussing and moaning to myself all the way through that.

And then I thought: Well, hang on. What else would I rather be doing? What else could I be doing? Stacking shelves in a supermarket? Stop moaning and just draw. You’re still creating. And even in phases where I’ve looking for work and no one was really giving me work I was happy. Well, having said that, I’ve actually never been completely out of work. There was always something. Yeah, touch wood.
I’m thankful, there’s always been something, even in the lower periods. 



CG [FP]: Last question. Which series, title, whatever, do you think is the most underestimated one nowadays?

CA: I don’t actually read that many comics.



CG [FP]: Oh, you don’t? You don’t have the time?

CA: Yeah, in a way it’s that. As I keep saying, when you’ve got kids and stuff, you just don’t have the time to sit back and read.



CG [FP]: Okay, let’s say underestimated artist or author.

CA: I don’t get access to too many comics. Because I live in a small town. There isn’t a big comic shop that has lots of stuff.

What I would say is that in the commercial American market there is a lack of decent superhero titles. And I think the fun should be re-introduced into superheroes.
The stuff I have enjoyed reading in the mainstream would be stuff like She-Hulk and Darwyn Cooke’s The New Frontier. Those approached it from the fun element first and they had good story telling. Even though they are two completely different titles in how they approach things.

That’s what the comic industry need right now. And not Identity Crisis. That’s what it doesn’t need. That’s for the pure, slavish fanboys that think superheroes should be serious. They think that it’s grown up. It’s not grown up. Men in underwear, that’s not grown up, I’m sorry. So, there should be more fun in comics. New artists should inject more of that.
Then, we might actually get some children reading them. The next generation, rather than thirty- or fourty-year-olds who read Identity Crisis. “This is great, ‘cause it’s really serious.” No. It’s rubbish. It’s rubbish. A bunch of people in their underwear sat around at a funeral crying. And the Elongated Man’s face is melting... just like that Robert Crumb cartoon... into his hands. [laughs]
Anyway.



CG: Have you seen the Justice League Unlimited cartoons? I’m getting on everybody’s nerves with that, but I think that’s how superheroes should be done.

CA: Oh, I’ve not seen that. I’ve seen clips and stills from it.



BW: They are taking all the stupid stuff and they’re running with it. Yes, we know that Gorilla Grodd is a completely stupid idea... but we are having fun with it.

CA: Yeah, exactly. If you’re having fun with it, it doesn’t matter. It’s when they have Gorilla Grodd and they take him seriously, that’s when the rot sets in. And that’s the problem I have with things like Identity Crisis.
In the end, Frank Miller and Alan Moore were doing the serious superheroes back in the mid-eighties. And, you know, surely we got over that by now. And they were better anyway.



CG [FP]: We're at the end. Thank you very much!

CA: No problem!



LINKS:

Charlie Adlard at Wikipedia

very detailed interview with Charlie at 2000 AD on ... everything, I think (February 2005)

Charlie's original art for sale at Splash Page Art

Cross Cult (German publisher of The Walking Dead)

Image Comics (US publisher of The Walking Dead)

AiT/PlanetLar

Comicgate interview with Robert Kirkman (fall 2005)

Comicgate interview with Tony Moore (end of 2005)


image sources: fumetti.org (White Death); fantasticfiction.co.uk (Astronauts in Trouble); kungfurodeo.com (TWD page from Charlie); comicon.com (Rock Bottom cover), Charlie Adlard (Rock Bottom pages), 2000adonline.com; stomptokyo.com (Identity Crisis)